Tuesday, September 27, 2005

Amma's Birthday Gift From The Press: Unintended Irony

File under: Amma All-Over-The-Planet

An Indian newspaper has provided some divinely inspired irony regarding Amma's 52nd birthday celebration. The headline says: Amma's birthday celebrated without pomp, while the second paragraph reads:
Close to 200,000 people arrived here at Amritapuri to celebrate the birthday of the spiritual leader popularly known as "amma" or mother.
There is not a single religious leader in the U.S. who could pull half as many as that. It's an elucidating reflection of Hindu spiritual culture and its seemingly insatiable appetite for godmen and women of all stripes and moral dispositions.

We believe a person could do a lot worse than Ammachi, yet it's not her divinity that's driving her popularity. The Indian public creates these "deities" out of the traditions of Hinduism. Amma was just in the right places at the right times with the right message, and most importantly, with the right stories of miracles circulating around her.


At 9/28/2005 7:57 AM, Blogger Bhakti said...

I'm not an Amma-bot (as you would say) and I'm certainly not in the position to defend or rip apart Ammachi--but I will share some advice from my beloved Shankaracharya--
"The spiritual seeker who is possessed of tranquility, self-control, mental poise and forbearance, devotes himself to the practice of contemplation, and meditates upon Atman within himself as the Atman within all beings. Thus he completely destroys the sense of separateness which arises from the darkness of ignorance, and dwells in joy, identifying himself with Brahman, free from distracting thoughts and selfish occupations."

If you were truly Self-realized you'd see that all of this (Guru-dom) is also a manifestation of the Shakti--and an extension of yourself. Why hate it so much?

The world's a mirror--wipe it clean.

Love to you,

At 9/28/2005 8:39 AM, Blogger jody said...

If you were truly Self-realized you'd see that all of this (Guru-dom) is also a manifestation of the Shakti--and an extension of yourself. Why hate it so much?

Do you feel the same way about the war in Iraq?

Knowing that all is the manifestation of Shakti doesn't change the fact that some of it sucks. War sucks, and the occluding myths that constellate around big time gurus suck.

The Atman doesn't care if it sucks because the Atman has absolutely no involvement in the world at all. But we are all also individuals with points of view to which some things seem to suck more than others. For instance, you think my criticism of gurudom sucks. Denying one's personal point of view is not jnana, it's being an ostrich with head stuck in sand.

At 9/28/2005 9:01 AM, Blogger Bhakti said...

I DON'T think your point of view sucks, Jody. If I did, I wouldn't stay in touch with you.

Personally, I think the war in Iraq is a wonderful thing. I think it's terrific that we've killed innocent people over there, and that my friends (who were in the National Guard) were sent over their to build schools and things like that when I actually have to spend my OWN money to buy my students pencils. (Seriously, I think the war in Iraq is disgusting.)

I don't think your opinion sucks. I'm just wondering why you would spend so much of your time on this 'mission' when you yourself admitted (on a comment to me on your site) that you weren't sure of Gurumayi's stance on experiences. To me that means that you haven't read her literature: In every one of Baba's books he states that to focus on experiences is missing the point.

You can use the word 'hagiograpic' to describe the biographies of the 'dead' saints, the ones no longer around in human form, but you can't deny my experiences.

I love your opinions...I just don't believe that your intention is to expose the truth of gurus...I think it's to gain fame for yourself. See, I think the dharmic thing for you to do would be to promote Vedanta so MORE people could see that there is a truth within themselves.

My point is this: You're preaching to the converted. Let's not forget that the people in Leaving Siddha Yoga went to the guru looking for something and didn't get what they expected. Now they have you...to preach to them. Now they have someone else to 'believe in' and follow. Why not show them the truth within themselves?

The thing I find funny about he LSY people is that they accuse Baba of sexual activities, and then the get mad at Gurumay when she kicks her brother out of the ashram for screwing his personal secretary. Do you see the irony in all of this?? (I'm not suggesting to know the truth about Baba's affairs)

And, please, Jody, I thought I made it clear that I don't consider you an adversary. Anyone who makes me challenge my beliefs is actually a blessing.

At 9/28/2005 11:09 AM, Blogger Liza said...

War sucks, and the occluding myths that constellate [sic] around big time gurus suck.

I would agree that any and all wars suck; but I would disagree that any and all gurus and spiritual teachers sucks.

But what really sucks, is this blog: Maha-generalization is bad for your health and makes you look really studid/bigoted/narrowminded. Can you spell pathetic?

Jody: you should have remained organizing raves.

Liza E.

At 9/28/2005 11:21 AM, Blogger jody said...

I would agree that any and all wars suck; but I would disagree that any and all gurus and spiritual teachers sucks.

Your egregiously inaccurate "maha-generalization" of my opinion about gurus is noted.

At 9/28/2005 11:25 AM, Blogger Bhakti said...

I wish Jody knew about the people (Gurus) he's writing about before defaming them. He's admitted that he's never been a Gurumayi devotee, and obviously hasn't read her work. He takes the adversarial stance because there are a group of people who don't like her. Well, there are a group of people who don't like George Bush, but that doesn't mean he's all bad.

Wait, on second thought, that wasn't a good analogy, was it...

At 9/28/2005 11:35 AM, Blogger jody said...

He takes the adversarial stance because there are a group of people who don't like her.

Where do you get this crap? Are you pulling it straight out of your ass? I've explained to you why I criticize Gurumayi. I've been to see her twice, once live and once on satellite TV. Both times people fawned over her like she was God, and both times I was encouraged to see her the same way. The atmosphere was very cult-like, and people were telling me the most ridiculous things about how "powerful" she was and how miraculous things happened around her.

Gurumayi is a perfect example of the storm of occluding myth that constellates around big time gurus. That is why I criticize her, Bhakti, your passive-aggressive assertions notwithstanding.

At 9/28/2005 12:01 PM, Blogger Bhakti said...

I've seen and felt her 'magical powers' in person.

I didn't pull that out of my ass...you DID say that there has to be truth in the falseness of certain gurus simply because of the large groups of people who have left some of them. I know that you went to her twice, but just because YOU didn't feel anything doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. I didn't 'feel' anything around the Dalai Lama, but I still believe that he has touched HIS devotees in a certain way that perhaps I haven't been touched.

To me your mission seems like a negation of spirituality in the world. I look around and see God. I see him shimmering, throbbing and existing everywhere. You negate that this is possible simply because you negate that it is possible that a human being could see or feel some else's 'god-hood', which is innate to all of us.

Like I said before, I bet there are thousands of 'devotees' who go to Gurumayi who aren't true seekers--even Gurumayi eluded to that when she said that only about 5% of her followers are true seekers. That's not HER fault...it's theirs. Not that it's a fault not to know the truth.

Her WHOLE mission is to for people to "Experience the Power Within" and realize that "God dwells within you as you."

It's not that difficult to understand--if you're a true seeker.

And, by the way, I'm well aware that consciousness is unaffected and unaware of things like the war in Iraq. The world is like an ocean (to borrow from TM) and all of this 'stuff' (including my writing to you and you writing back) are just little waves crashing into one another.

We're all part of the same ocean...its just a play (of consciousness) that we're involved in. That's why I don't understand your mission. You're never going to be able to negate the existence of the saints that have walked, and continue to walk the earth. Their sole purpose is to show people the Self that exists within themselves (save for the phoney ones).

I'm here to tell you that Gurumayi is NOT a phoney.

By the way, what's your take on Jesus?

At 9/28/2005 5:49 PM, Blogger Liza said...

Jesus?... Jody is a good Jewish guy, so his "take" in Jesus will scare the bejesus out of you :)

Or maybe he will use the "out of your ass" peyorative yet again.

Look Bhakti, I am Jewish as well, and we get angry pretty quickly (from witty to obnoxious in 10 seconds). So don't get my Jody angry, OK?

Liza E.

At 9/28/2005 7:43 PM, Blogger Bhakti said...

Don't get all bent out of shape--Jesus is Jewish! :)

Okay...I'll rephrase my question for Jody...What's your take on Moses? :P

Also, Jody--do you think Hanuman was half monkey/half man--or half man/half monkey?

Also, I'd like to apologize to everyone reading my comments for the sheer lack of 'their vs. there' discrimination. The post-surgery pain killers I'm on are wreaking havoc on my grammar. I hope I haven't offended anyone in that department. If so, please email Jody.

and Jody: do you think that the hair on your dog's behind is more special than the hair on my cat's rearend simply because his owner hasn't been 'occluded' to the truth the way I have? Oh--wait, that brings me to the questin--how is it that SOME of Gurumayi's devotees are NOT occluded to the truth, and some are?

And, what is this fascination with 'occlude'? I think the word 'block' would suffice...

At 9/28/2005 10:12 PM, Blogger Liza said...

Bhakti ... easy, easy .... Two women against one man is not a fair deal...

Let us give Jody some respite, OK?

Between his dog's rearend capillaris and your cat's, we are getting readers all occluded. LOL!

Liza E.

At 9/29/2005 9:12 AM, Blogger Bhakti said...

Thinking about Jody's comment about me being 'passive aggressive' leads me to believe that this website is running under the quise of being 'humorous' and is, in fact, a serious mission.
Therefore, since my last comments were for sheer entertainment on my part, and in no way were meant to offend Jody, I am saying 'goodbye'. I'm going to focus on the 'light' and focus on my own site.
Since blogging on this site is NOT for humorous purposes, to continue blogging here would render me as helpless as Sisyphus.

Jody--thanks again for updating the info on Sally.

Best wishes--Bhakti

At 10/21/2005 9:29 AM, Blogger WholeTruth said...

Thank you guys for calling people like Jody to the carpet. I, too, really wonder what's behind such commitment to negativety. Look at the time and effort put into sites like this and Rick Ross! It's really amazing! This site took someone a lot of time to put together and it attracts so many people who are afraid of things that they have never experienced. They open themselves to rummor and fear, but close themselves to everything else. Maybe Jody is afraid tha there might be be more truth that he/she'd care to admit.

At 6/13/2006 5:51 AM, Anonymous blomma said...

Keep in mind.... that unless you judge by your own experience.. everything else is just rumours and not facts, whether it be good or bad.. they may sound lovely or horrible.. you still cant be sure of any of them, without own experience.

Praise or slander dont matter, theyre still both dangerous if youre not sure of them.

Assumptions are what allow us to be fooled.

Dont beleive in others truths unless there is real substance to it.


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